New Developments in the Park Shi Hoo Rape Allegation Investigation

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• "Consent cannot be inferred from the absence of a “no”; a clear “yes,” verbal or otherwise, is necessary."

  I'm a lawyer myself and I'm not so sure the answer is so straightforward as you make it out to be. I would venture that 99% of the time, consent is not derived from a verbal "yes, I consent to sex". You, of course, have the caveat that the "yes" need not be verbal by the use of "otherwise". I assume you mean body language which is the predominant way consent is given and signaled. But the very nature of body language is that it is very subjective. What is a clear "yes" to one may not be to another.

  Thus, that A did not say "yes" tells us nothing really. What is more crucial is what did A do (which is difficult to establish given that its PSH's word against hers) and how that behaviour should be interpreted.

  • I agree. Body language could also be some kind of consent; it doesn't always have to be verbal. Who made the first move? Who touched who in a way that the person might have found a misunderstanding in? There are many questions, but no one knows exactly what happened after the arrival to the apartment.

    A person might have said something that was particulary meant in a different way then what the other person believes to be. The same goes for the body language as well. On the other hand, it could have been the very opposite.

  • @ Paul

    That was the implication of the caveat - other forms of communication for consent. Body language, physical response, written agreement, sign language, you name it, all could indicate consent. I didn't want to have to list it one by one. But consent in whatever form of communication must be clear and cannot be inferred from a person not saying no. You agree?

    • As a matter of law, you are correct: "consent must be clear". But my point is that the law is not entirely helpful in that regard. That legal standard merely shifts the fight to what constitutes "clear". In the right circumstances, it might even be accurate to say that not saying no is a clear yes. Such circumstances would be, admittedly, rare but not improbable.

    • Not saying no when one is sober could be interpreted as yes. But when the person passed out, unable to communicate one way or another, not saying no can still be yes?

  • Let's be realistic, consent has always been the crucial element in every sexual assault case but due to the nature of sexual assault - his word against hers, consent has always been a murky area. Essentially that is the rate of conviction for sexual assaults are so low. A lot of the times, the perpetrator only needs to prove that he 'believed' that she was consenting, and then the legal team goes off with their tactics to paint that picture - which often causes added pressure and humiliation for the victim.

• Koala, thank you so very much for laying the facts black and white and for voicing your opinions from a legal (and very legitimate at that) point of view. I've just been keeping up but refraining from taking a stance on either sides. I do believe that regardless what the outcome is, my personal views of him has been affected - not necessarily negatively, but definitely something's shifted that rewatching TPM might now come with an uncomfortable underlying feeling.

• You made some good points within this post. Nothing is impossible in this world and anything can happen. No one knows exactly what could have happened after the ride to the apartment. It could be true that he did so, but then again it could be a lie and true that "A" planned on lying about getting raped in the first place to probably boost her popularity.

  For one, why do idiotic things in the first place. There are individuals who would do anything to become famous and there are famous people who would do something foolish that damages their reputation.

  Sometimes when a person drinks more than they could handle, they could possibly partake in the action, but then don't remember what happened that night and think of the opposite. It is weird to say the least that "A" walked out conscious, but then to be unconscious when arriving at the apartment. There is always a missing piece to a puzzle.

  No one in this world is perfect and there are some cruel people in this world. Whether they are famous or not.

  • Raise her popularity? I don't see how she can raise her popularity by being a rape victim if she is trained to be a celebrity.

    If she win the case, her name is forever tarnished as rape victim of PSH.
    If she lose, it is even worse. Even before yesterday article of CCTV footage was revealed, people already jumped in and pointing fingers at her by calling her kkot-baem (kkot-baem = flower snake. used to describe a girl that allures men with her looks only to bite them in the ass with a rape/sexual harassment charge).

    Either way, she is definitely won't be popular for a good thing out of this.

  • Wait, gaining popularity by getting raped!? Wow, if true, I am seriously shocked and worried about the younger generations..

• I will admit that I am a fan but I don't know his personality outside his dramas (not that their image is always a true representation of their actual personality).

  I'll only say that it is not looking good for him. And, seriously, the whole revealing outfit=you deserve it mentality is sick! I understand though that everyone should be as responsible as possible, especially at drinking gatherings with strangers.

  • I agree. I am a fan also due to hia acting, but it is hard to decipher a person when you do not know their peesonality. Many people could put up a image about themselves, but could possibly be the opposite of that image. Who knows?

    People have to look at both sides of the matter, and rape is a serious crime also.

  • I just don’t understand how to become a fan of any actor/actress. It is like having full faith in a politician. Face it, how do you really know a person all you can see is in acting? I don’t think you can know him through the characters he portrayed, or his public image articulated by him and his agency. Without knowing whom he/she really is off screen, I don’t have much feeling towards them. Therefore, I don’t feel heartbreaking when I found this incident, only a bit annoyed.

    • I don't think being a 'fan' means having full faith in someone or necessarily liking them as person (or pretending to know them as person in real life, outside their profession).

      You can be a fan and like someone's work (due to their quality acting, or looks, or whatever - people will have different reasons), meaning you will watch whatever drama/film etc. they are in because you are fairly certain you'll enjoy it.

      That said, I would never call myself anyone's fan because the term has become too associated with crazy behaviour. I merely follow certain people's works.

    • yes, I am a fan of good shows even the characters in the shows but not really the actors/actresses who portray the characters.

• Thanks a lot for the info, particularly this one:

  "I’m being super specific because as a lawyer I hate when people don’t understand that a person (man or woman) is allowed to change their minds to sex whether before or during the encounter."

  Also the last paragraph about consent. I always side-stepped this kind of issue, but I think it's important for me to educate myself.

  Btw, I didn't realise you were a lawyer. Now some of your very detailed posts made sense.

  I hope truth wil prevail, somehow. I don't know the likelihood of both CCTV recordings tampered (low, probably), but if they are not tampered with, those recordings can be very bad for these K actors.

• This is like an episode out of Criminal Minds.

  • Oh just glad to see my favorite TV show getting a mention here :-)

• I'm thinking PSH slipped on that new evidence found -- the girl was clearly not conscious if she had to be carried.
  If he felt like he had to brush over something as important as that.. Clearly something's fishy.
  Honestly, i really like PSH but if he truly did rape her(not accusing) then i don't think he should have it any easier than your avg. joe. But reality is, as koala says, "money and power always talks in the end".

• Thank you Mrs. Koala for stating the facts so clearly. I am with you on the question of what was she wearing... I almost threw my laptop when I read questions of that sort being asked not only by the press but by netizens, many of them woman saying that their oppa ( fill in the the blank) and that A was probably looking for it. it made me so angry...God I'm still angry.

  Also I have a question, do you happen to know the legal definition for rape on the Korean Judicial system? I know that it varies from country to country and that while consent is a common factor there are always nuances from definition o definition that can be a major factor on the final decisions of rape cases.

• Funny how the news never reports what the man was wearing.

  Parody/
  "The accused was wearing low-rise, dark-wash denim jeans, paired with a deep-V neck, semi-sheer Tshirt. Jacket was said to be black leather with buckles."

  I share in your table-flipping at such f*ckery.

  Put me on that jury -- I want to see the CCTV tapes -- because this whole thing is convoluted.

  In the Kdrama world...even dating...like regular going-to-get-coffee-together is a SCANDAL !!! so how something THIS extreme occurred between people working in the industry -- who presumably would KNOW there was CCTV...Why the HELL did the friend carry the woman into Shi-Hoo's apt.?

  That guy needs to tell the unvarnished truth...whatever it is.

  • Agreed. Society, all over the world, need to get it in their heads that ALL fault lies with the perpetrator. Rape is an attack, a violation.

• Thank you for updating us on this and explaining things clearly Koala.