Sorry if it appeared I’ve suddenly leapt off the Queen In Hyun’s Man runaway train what with the radio silence in the last few days. I was vacationing and for some reason I wasn’t in a rush to watch episode 12. Despite loving episode 11 when I watched it, something felt off afterwards. After I watched episode 12, I finally realized what it was. Boong Do appears to have a general personality shift, one that is quite a leap from his Joseon educated ways. I love seeing romantic moments between the OTP, but the post-memory-lost-regained-his-memory Boong Do seems to be a different guy almost, with all the same gentlemanly mannerisms and his intelligence intact, but very forward with Hee Jin in a way that feels abrupt. Don’t have to agree with me, since his personality change has resulted in massive amounts of fan service on the romance front for the OTP. Which really leads me to my biggest gripe about episode 12 – it was a cute episode where nothing happened other than Boong Do and Hee Jin spending time together in their usual sweet ways. I still adore QIHM and this drama is leaps above the other two I watched this weekend, but I hope it regains its footing and gets back on track with the storytelling rather than subsisting on the cute.
Written preview for episode 13:
Min Ahm’s counter-attack….!
Knowing that Boong Do is intending to go to the other world, Yoon Wol conveys the monk’s warning about the talisman, hoping to change Boong Do’s mind. On the other hand, Hee Jin has bought a new cell phone for Boong Do, and on a day they didn’t make plans together, Boong Do’s cell phone rings. Hee Jin happily answers the cell phone only to hear unexpected news……
New preview for episode 13:
i don’t think his personality has seen a massive shift, he WAS a bit playful, with a hidden streak of rascalness (sorry for the non-existent word)… he was just bound by the culture & customs of his side, so he behaved with the manners and reserve of that era in which he was brought up… but boongdo is, in a sense, a modern man (remember, he showed very little shock at Heejin’s so-called-goodbye-kiss, even though it is safe to assume that such behavior might not have existed in his time… why, being a nobleman, he might’ve very well thought wanton, but he found her charming & passionate, albeit a bit shameless.. so maybe in heejin and the year 2012, he has found that he has that playful side in him, which he can now freely express, not bound by societal hierarchy, etiquette and manners of yonder era… so it’s not a personality switch, and maybe this newfound freedom to be more expressive might also have led to his decision to be in 2012…
but ya, ep 12 did feel like filler or fan-service, but hey, i can take an interim pair of cute episodes to balance other plot-heavy or angsty episodes… very cute OTP, who tempt me too much to ship in real-life 🙂
I love the fanservice, too.
But it would have been really cool if instead of taking her on a bike ride, they went out on horseback. He could have showed off his skills, and she could have seen him less as a fish out of water, but a man defined by his time.
I hafta agree with u. I think his personality didn’t change. Rather, his playffanulness side was unleashed. Esp after alr thinking he’d be staying in the modern world. He needed to adapt to their life all the more. Although the fan service angle is true like what koala said, hahah that kinda makes me wanna watch the next ep all the more-for plot mvmt and more fan service scenes.
I didn’t find anything wrong with it either, after all, we are in episode 12, it is time we moved the romantic front forward….only two weeks left. Also, after the memory loss senario and the treat of another man claiming his girlfriend, I wasn’t suprised he would lay a physical claim to complete the bond.
But he’s a yangban! Raised as one, educated at Sungkyunkwan, is a government official. He can be someone who is calm when absorbing new experiences and is forward thinking even for his time and his position, but in no way would it be realistic for him to suddenly behave like a modern boyfriend romancing his newfounded lady love in the way he did in ep 12. He could have accepted coming to live in the modern world, but his personality and behavior would still reflect his upbringing for the most part with some deviations for his hidden playful side and his willingness to learn modern mores. But it wouldn’t be a wholesale perfect cheesy loverboy coming out. His sudden personality shift actually bothered me because it took me out of the moment, being so unbelievable especially since he was written to be the ideal personification of a yangban.
In comparison, I look at how Tamra The Island handled the perfect yanban Park Kyu’s fish-out-of-water experience on Tamra and his growth when he fell in love with Beo Jin, yet his personality and the way he carried himself remained intact even as he added new understanding, altered his behavior in certain ways, and ultimately become a more complete person as the end (as opposed to a new version of himself).
I love how you bring up Park Kyu, and completely agree with everything you said in regards to his change in character throughout Tamra. Also, I agree with you (and I guess I am one of the few) about Kim Boong Do’s sudden change in character. He became too modern all of a sudden, and lost that extra special part of him that came from him being a Joseon scholar.
Team Park Kyu FTW! Still the most perfect perfect PERFECT Joseon male character ever written. Kim Boong Do is something special, but he’s not quite Park Kyu.
Interesting…I can see what you are saying…Did he seem too relaxed? Too modernized?
Could it be something as simple as he has made a decision as to where he wants to spend his future and he is letting go of the Joseon ways?
Could it be that when he returned to Joseon days and ways, the time spent in 2012 had already altered him enough that he no longer felt right being there(then?)?
Could it be the last leap before he regained his memory changed him for ever for good, and that change meant a committment to fate whatever that means – which made him bolder?
I am getting shooper nervous about the consequences of using the amulet for selfish reasons…
Why he can’t be foward with HJ? I mean, after realizing she is very important to him, and finally meeting her back, he just let himself be more comfortable with her. Aren’t couples like that?
You mean the bed scene? I do agree if they did it, it is really out of character…
What I loved about the characterizations in QIHM is how the writer tries to juxtapose Hee Jin’s modern playful ways with Boong Do’s assured genteel Joseon ways for the last 10 eps. Suddenly in ep 11-12, Boong Do was acting like a modern boyfriend, and not a Joseon-era boyfriend. Boong Do is a yangban, there is no way in hell a Joseon-era scholar steeped on Confucian mores and proper etiquette would be suddenly behaving this way. As a couple, he would be showing his affection in much more subtle and reserved ways, as he had been doing earlier. The kiss in the car in ep8 was out-of-character but it made sense since emotionally he was taking a great leap forward. Now that he’s chosen Hee Jin, he would still be the same him and treat her like he would if she was his woman back in Joseon times, with a bit of modern playfulness, but not this torrential outpouring of romanticism. It’s the lack of character consistency I’m pointing out, and the abruptness. If after a few months in 2012 had gone by with them together, then Boong Do’s actions would seem much more plausible. For 10 eps we’ve seen Joseon Boong Do slowly acclimate to modern ways, but in ep 11-12 he took a quantum leap.
Oh I see… thanks for replying.
That is true he changed very fast, but it could also be because he is madly in love? lol not sure…. but I understand what you want to say…
maybe he was always a modern man, ahead of his times??? i mean, like i said in my previous comment, he already was pretty fast in adapting to and adopting the modern culture ( the kiss in the library, i mean i’m pretty sure he never bought her explanation of a kiss being a good-bye gesture, but he was playful & forrward enough to make use of the situation – maybe he really is a player, those tendencies having been confined by his era’s cultural norms, now freed up)… after all, he did confess to a disconnect with his era, now that he has been in the future… & i don’t think it’s only because he already knows what happens and doesn’t want to live a predestined life… i think, deeper than that, he has already seen, and taken a liking to the New World, which had brought out other facets of his character… because, face it, his era, filled with its conservative attitudes and customs, coupled with political intrigues, and his life-or-death stakes didn’t provide him with much opportunities to be the cute, flirty, romantic guy that he is… after all, he still retains his intelligence, wit and good nature, and they haven’t exactly shown any scenes of his with his wife…
Miss Koala, I beg to differ on all your comments conerning Boong Do’s character change. I still don’t know why you would think that people in the joseon era were restricted…just because they didn’t show feelings opening does not mean they didn’t in private and everyone has an inner devil in them. I think what you failed to realize from the writers viewpoint is the fear of loss that has motivated this forward momentum of growth from our time-traveler. He realized he almost forgot the woman he loves, plus another man was already trying to lay claim on her. Any red blooded male would know that it’s time for drastic measures and lay his claim….Plus the possiblity of losing the amulet and not being able to return. I also believe the writer has always portrayed him as someone who adapts well to new surroundings….he was never freaked out about time traveling to the 21st century. Therefore, there is no character flaw whatsoever! He also said that he no longer feels any connection to his era, but more at one with ours. For a scholar like him, I would expect that. Also, who wants to live knowing when you will die or your loved ones.
I could forgive the “spend the night with me” because the kissing fried my brain and made me all loopy with happiness, but NO WAY would a proper yangban ever ever make that comment to a woman who is not yet his legal wife. I don’t care if he’s in Joseon, modern, hell, heaven, wherever, it’s just not consistent with his morals and upbringing. And for it to happen so abruptly is the kicker. Like I said, BD is a quite adapter, a few months in 2012 and I’d be totally lapping up all his boyfriendy behavior. But then later BD was being all affectionate with HJ publicly (bike ride, in the phone booth), which are all sweet but once again such a huge gap between how he was raised and how he suddenly is behaving. He spent nearly 30 years as a Joseon scholar, steeped in the very essence of Confucian behavior where how low one bows is perfectly timed and every word out of his mouth is correctly used depending on who he is talking to. He’s not some random Joseon era man, he’s a high court official from an formerly esteemed family. It’s the abruptness of his behavioral change that caught me off guard.
BD did say that he has spent a few months in 2012…long enough to know that HJ was “conning” him again with regards to the “carre rice” meal she made him…so he has been adapting thru his few months in 2012…so his boyfriend behavior is not as abrupt as it might seem…
LOVE THIS Description:
“He spent nearly 30 years as a Joseon scholar, steeped in the very essence of Confucian behavior where how low one bows is perfectly timed and every word out of his mouth is correctly used depending on who he is talking to.”
What we are seeing his the actor’s personality nudging the writing a little, which may not be true to the character, I admit.
I agree to some extent. The nature of men and women and relations hasn’t changed much in thousands of years and it goes beyond culture, race, and era. I don’t think it was out of character for him to ask her to spend the night but the lovey dovey date was kind of over the top. The minute I saw it I thought…”he must have looked up how to date modern girls”. That would be more fitting in his character.
Just because he was good at following the rules of the society he lived in doesn’t mean those rules embody who he truly is. It goes back to the question of how would we behave if the rules of our society suddenly didn’t exist. If this was the case then writers should have done more to flesh out the nature vs nurture conflict. Since they did it so abruptly it feels like it was thrown in for more fanservice.
I love this show to pieces but I do understand what you are trying to say Koala.
Thank you Beeboop saying whats on my mind.
At work in the middle of an experiment so this will be quick. I completely agree with you in that Boong Do’s shift in personality was a bit jarring thus leaving me a bit off after episodes 11 and 12. I mean we have seen little bits of him being more forward with HeeJin in the preceding episodes as he adapted to modern mannerisms and lifestyle but even so he still kept his Joseon manners in a way albeit a bit more forward than we expect a yanban to be. However in episodes 11 and 12 he suddenly is a lot more affectionate than I expected of his character. I mean as much as I like fanservice, I was a bit surprised and taken back by the fact that he wanted her to stay the night and the fact that they full on made out because although noblemen had relations with ginsaengs , in regards to women they wanted to marry they would never act like that. Having a woman he wants as a future wife stay the night before marriage would be unheard of in Joseon times so I was a bit surprised they had his character do that or appear to do that. As for the bike ride, since he had wanted to do cheesy things for HeeJin prior to the memory loss I wasn’t that surprised by the bike ride date since he essentially started where he left off prior to losing his memory which was him wanting to be a cheesy good boyfriend to her but I was surprised by how affectionate he was during that date.
In terms to how long he has been jumping from the past to the future, based on the amount of time that seem to be in question during his memory loss (didn’t he say when he woke up in episode 9 that he didn’t know what happened for the past ~2 months) he has been in the future for a couple of months now so its plausible for him to act like a modern man but based on his mannerisms and actions in the episodes prior to the memory loss it seems a bit of a jump to have him become a full-on cassanova.
Why is it out of character…whatever makes you think he didn’t take mistresses in the joseon time. Affections may not be shown openly doesn’t mean none is shown in private…and for christ sake…he is a man and gotta take charge.
Because the drama spent 10 episodes telling us and showing us that Boong Do is the ideal personification of a yangban. He’s perfect – honorable, upstanding, and the epitome of proper etiquette in public. Of course he didn’t take a mistress. Another Joseon man, I wouldn’t know. But we’re told BD is a pretty much the pinnacle of what a scholar would be, and there the personality shift is because we’re talking about HIM, and not some formless Joseon person coming to the modern times.
“He’s perfect – honorable, upstanding, and the epitome of proper etiquette in public” “Honorable” and “Upstanding” maybe…..but the “epitome of proper etiquette in public”? I don’t think the writer delved that deep into his character for us to judge that….we’ve only seen him fighting or running from his life. And we are not talking about anything he did publicly….we are talking about his behaviour with the woman he loves. I really don’t understand why it bordered you that his feelings will take new dimensions by episode 12. He’s been time traveling since episode 2 or so, enough time to have adapted well, for a character like his who wasn’t afraid of his new surroundings. Yes, he’s been respectful and modest with her, but deosn’t all relationships take a jump into next levels eventually especially when coupled with extinuating (did I spell that right) circumstances. I think you should rewatch episode 11 and 12 and maybe you will come out with new understanding.
I was surprised when he subtly asked HJ to spend the night with him, but NO, I don’t find his character inconsistent now and before. I agree with Eaglette that we had no idea about him behaving in the public.
In the set of 300 years ago, we saw him fighting, running away, saving the Queen, confronting Min Am, talking to Yoon Wol, Han Dong and the monk. And none gave me an impression that he always tried to behave as a “proper etiquette in public”. I remember when Han Dong told him not to reveal with anyone about his haircut, he even laughed and asked Han Dong why it should be a big deal. He didn’t care about whether people consider him as a respectable yanban or not; even Han Dong cared about his status more than him :). (Not to mention that most yanban should be terribly upset and felt guilty when his hair was cut, let alone he cut it himself.)
In the set of the modern time, he always acted carefully and cautiously, but I think mostly because he is a fish out of the water. He doesn’t know how to act proper in the modern time, so he must observe and think before he would speak and act. Still, he shows that he is quite an adaptive and open person. (library hug/kiss. the car kiss. being a thief. cut his hair himself)
Although I wasn’t extremely satisfying with ep 12, I still loved it, and found our characters believable and consistent. It is what I would expect from a widower to act when he is in front of the one he has been longing for a while :).
In the set of modern era,
I disagree with the “nothing happening” in episode 12. I believe the OTP had their first semi-fight (more on the uncertainty on whether or not Boong-do should stay in 2012). And Boong-do’s desire and interest in the future/present world has grown, which I think plays into plot development later on…
As for the character shift..I don’t necessarily see that either, since he also seems to have a “when in Rome” attitude that we’ve also seen previously in other episodes. In fact, this “adapting” attitude is very Taoist…
Just my 2 cents. We can agree to disagree. 🙂
I agree! The small fight in ep 12 was a great onward shift in their relationship. I felt that it brought BD back from his euphoric high, and crashed into brevity of the situation. So, while I agree that he was out of character, like Miss OcKoala said, I also believe it was because of the emotional state of their characters. They did spend a few months together in the modern and a month or so away as the repercussion of the talisman getting sliced.
That phone booth scene where he calls HJ was a touch of his old self, where he was thinking about how he was going to be “responsible for her”. As a fangirl I love that he blew off all his reason for her, but as a logical woman, were that me, I would be riling against him. LOL
But yes the “abrupt change” wasn’t consistent, but neither was it permanent.
I love his abrupt change – to me it signifies his willingness to accept/explore/investigate this modern world. He’s already commented that HJ is “impulsive” (and made the monumental discovery that he finds it attractive) When he stuck his tongue out at DM in EP 11 that was also out of character for someone of his background & upbringing. HJ is the one who has taught him these things and he trusts her so he’s also learning/learned a few things about modern day courtship. (who knows what other things he’s read about in the library) As far as all the romantic things, he did ask SK about doing “cheesy” things for HJ . So now he’s doing a few cheesy things with her that are acceptable in this modern world. I find it charming & believable.
I thought I was the only one at lost watching Episode 12, glad that you feel the same. Honestly, I only like the first half of Episode 11 and although the latter half of Episode 11 had so many cute scenes, I’m not really sold when BD becomes like a modern boyfriend. The reason why I’m so fascinated watching this drama is because of BD’s character as a yangban who falls in love with a modern woman. I really want BD to maintain his character as a yangban coz that’s his charisma and the way I look at it he’s losing it and i’m also losing my interest on this drama.
For me it’s even more than a quantum leap. He did say “In-Hyun Wanghu, I need to find out if its worth risking my life” he didn’t know for sure whether the talisman will work, and although he got pieces of info from YW and the monk about “the woman” and “the other world”, he is a very logical person. He laughed at his manservant when he told him about him disappearing and when YW gave him the talisman in the first place he said he didn’t believe in such thing. He’s an intellect through and through, so to take a stab like that it’s a leap of faith (and we saw that he got teary when he recalled his memory with Heejin)
He just showed us that he’s willing to die for her than he declared that he wanted to take responsibility a.k.a mine-ing her, so the way he showed his affection afterwards is human and logical for me no matter from what era he is.
And I agree with Tamara about his “when in Rome” attitude, I’ve noticed that too, and what other things he’s read about or even see in the modern society, he spent 3 days in Jejudo alone before Heejin picked him up. And he always says his only merit that he adapts very quick. Still the same Kim Boong-do for me, even bolder.
Thanks for the update. Yay! It’s Wednesday now! (4.27 AM here :P)
I kinda agree ep12 is a little ep about nothing – nothing major but it dealt with his n her issues about staying/going n to give us a bit of couple time. It’s the lull before the storm, me thinks.
The lull before the storm is what I want to say too! ^^’
I admit once I read the recaps I don’t have the urge to watch 11 & 12 RAW, unlike previous episodes, but actually waiting calmly for the subtitles to come out. But once I watch them, ah I still hooked as ever. I don’t find BD’s behaviour uncharacteristic of him. If anything, I always find his smile and laugh in the earlier episodes jarring against his sombre mood in Joseon. So by this time, I’m used to it and even expected that he will be able to behave like a modern boyfriend.
My reason for not being as crazy about these recent episodes is because everything with higher stakes are already settled. BD has his revenge, memory loss problem solved, BD manage to do time-travel again and BD acknowledged his love for HJ and they met. So now it’s the matter of moving forward, to stay or not to stay? And yes E12 is rather slow, not much plot movement there, but like Jammie said “It’s the lull before the storm”
I think BD is learning who he is maybe for the first time. EP 12 set up the stage for the rest of the series. BD decided to take responsible for loving Hejin. He found better understand the strain that them bring together has put on Heejin’s life. I don’t think.his demeanor changed I think he is being true to himself. He probably always wanted to act this way but because in the Josean era he has such a huge responsiblity to fulfill l not only for the queen but to for his family that were killed. Heejin brought out his repressed self I believe.
I love this discussion, everyone!
Thanks Koala, for getting the ball rolling on this one!
This is great: I think BD is learning who he is maybe for the first time.
As you and others have pointed out, he may have been very much a man of his time, of manners, of careful living, but the last 5 years tore him up. He has had to step out of his comfort zone of SKK scholar, husband and son and learn martial arts, learn to write with his left hand! His political party is out of favor. All the backyard barbecues were canceled.
He landed in a No Fun Zone.
He spent five years bent on revenge.Time in which he should have been truly happy raising kids, loving his wife, hanging with the rents.
My friend brought up the idea of survivor guilt – How DOES he deal with the fact that his parents had to die, his pregnant wife died, and prolly others close to his family – yet he lived? Min Am knew it would be both a blessing and a curse
Now, he fulfills that desire to fix things- he wins! Now what?
He ends up in a version of Disneyland for him. Airplane rides, kissing girls, no restrictions on his speech, clothing, and the only responsibility he has is to his lover. I think he is letting loose, too. He is doing things – selfish things- that make him happy. OK OK, would he have pouted, and expected his woman to sleep with him after less than one day? Maybe not. But but but there are only three weeks left!!!!!! We want the fanservice before the karma hits the fan.
agreed!!!
Interesting, very interesting to see people decoding different meaning of an issue. Thank you Ms Koala for your open talk.
I’m one of those people who were surprised and somehow alarmed at his abrupt change in Ep11. But on the other hand, I admire the thoughtful and emotional subtleness of Ep12. I adore Ep12 to bits, it’s one of the best episode for me, if not the best.
Ep11 as you said, Boong-do’s bold comment to Hee-jin still left me in doubt. I always believe nothing happened after the kiss, but the request “to spend the night with him” alone was a scandalous thought for him, a noble Confucious yangban. Till now I still don’t know what I should judge this action, was it purely fan-service? Or was it the writer’s purpose to create discussion among fans?
Episode 12, imo, was perfect in every aspect. It was beautiful balance between romance and reality. I really don’t understand why some of you said that it added nothing to the plot? I’m sorry, it’s meant a lot to the main story of the show: the love of the OTP. They are at the point when they need to discuss about their future, they understand their desire, and they need to face it. Ep 12 shown BD’s inner struggle, and for the first time ever HJ’s asked him to stay. She never kept him back before, but now she does. Ep 1 to 10 were watching two people falling in love, and episode 12 forward will be about two people in love fight against their obstacle before they finally get together.
I don’t think their lovey dovey date was over the top. The cuteness in Ep11, his pouty face in Ep11, I can’t get used to it. But in ep 12, he was back to his true-self as we’ve seen in the first 10 episodes. He’s always been playful around her, even when they were not lovers. He’s always been tender and caring to her. He has never hesitated to show his affection to her, in front of everyone. All those actions which lead to HJ’s remark “player”, he’s always shown it. And now they’re dating, a real couple., why does he need to keep his Joseon dignity around her, in the modern world? For his comment of last night, it was surely abrupt. But for their bike date, their phone booth scene, he’s been honest with his feelings. And mind you, their bike scene, at the end of the date, there it was, a crack of reality. Boong-do has never relieved himself from the past, he has never forgotten who he is, and thus his vague answers in all of HJ’s questions.
All I can say is “wow”! Loved your analysis. You said it for me, but better. I’ve never forgotten that he was married and was expecting a child. He’s no virgin. I’ve also suspected that he is a player, but in a nice way. I would call him a flirt instead.
hmmm i didn’t think boongdo was acting out of character though. remember the library hug where he asked heejin if hugging was appropriate between men and women and in public. when heejin told him that it doesn’t matter, his reply was “it’s a good world”, then he immediately hugged heejin (at this point in time i don’t think he had romantic feelings for heejin yet.. he only wanted to share his happiness with someone). this shows that deep inside he wasn’t a very reserved person.. perhaps all along he wanted to display openly display affection to the person he likes. he probably never did agree with all the customs during his joseon times, but he was just bounded by the customs of his times and had no choice but to follow the rules that society had set. in the modern world he was no longer bound by those customs and could freely express himself. hence, i didn’t think he was very out of character in ep 12…
I agree with you yampaste; agreeing and bound by are two different things. Just because Boong Do’s bound by the customs and mores of his era doesn’t mean he agrees with them. He’s been time skipping for a couple of months and since he’s a fast learner he must have observed well how couples nowadays spend their time together. Remember he learned to give the car to Hee Jin in a corny way, he knows she likes him doing corny things for her. Asking HJ to stay the night is, I believe, his playful way to ask her to spend more time with him. After all, he nearly lost her. And playful is being consistent with his character because, whether in action or in speech, he has always been playful with HJ, and you can feel at times there’s a cheeky devil lurking in him even when he’s being the perfect gentleman. I know that’s why I love BD.
Besides, BD is a thoroughly modern man, in any era, if it weren’t for social constraints he would do anything he pleases and to hell with customs. If you remember during the the time of his lost memory he asked Yoon Wol, who was his wife’s slave turned gisaeng to become his wife, which is a no no for a person of his status, the most she could be would be a mistress or concubine. BD doesn’t care for conventions despite his upbringing. YW was the one who was offended and upset that he could think and propose such a thing, or maybe she feels he doesn’t love her but asking out of duty because she helped him so much, but the point is he still thought of it when even the person you’d think who would jump at the idea was aghast.
Could it be that some of us are finding this a little jarring to see that someone who, at first, looks like the epitome of the perfect scholar from a bygone era could spout words one would expect to hear from a modern day playboy? I personally don’t think it was too abrupt a change, I think every episode showed a little bit more of a different dimension of BD, building up to the scene where he felt so comfortable around HJ that he felt he could say those words to her. BD’s strong points are adapting well and learning fast! Yes, I agree some of the scenes in 11 and 12 were fan service but BD isn’t your average Joseon scholar so I’m OK with both of these episodes.
If BD is to make a potentially life changing decision of staying in the future we need to see the couple as a regular couple in normal circumstances; not the heroine helping the hero out or the hero paying back the heroine’s kindness, and definitely not the hero throwing a life away for a woman who likes to kiss him on impulse and him kissing back. A full episode showing life as it could be for our couple may be a little extravagant in drama time wise, especially since there are only four episode left, but it builds up to show this couple, despite a huge problem, just might be able to live life happily together, BD needs to feel and see this to make a decision to ’emigrate’ to modern Seoul. I don’t know if this is the writer’s intention but this is how I saw it.
Dear ockoala,
I agree with you whole-heartedly! Thanks for standing your ground.
P. S. I’m a newcomer to kdrama, and love your site! Keep up the good work!
what a discussion! i’m on the side who’s not bothered by the shift al all…. i welcome all BD’s advancement. 😀 proper yanban or not, i still believe that people in olden times are restricted to act not because they want to but because of the social expectations. being noble and such, they were expected to act in proper decorum all the time, but that doesn’t mean when people are not watching they don’t become playful. and hot blooded males will always be hot blooded males, whatever era it may be 😀
Dear ockoala,
I agree with you whole-heartedly! Thanks for standing your ground.
Ms. Koala, you have my backing~~ about BoongDo’s characterization being a bit off, for me at least in ep 11. Ep 12 I could tolerate, since he’s just trying to show his affection after the whole lost memories scare– indulging in her cute/silliness like he’s done before, learning new things to make her happy– for the most part, it’s consistent, though it was like an avalanche of it compared to how little time they get to spend together in the first 10 episodes….
but I definitely wrinkle my forehead about ep 11: kiss and stay with me deal (though the former was… indulging to us viewers haha) kiss i can tolerate 50%, the stay with me deal… 20%
as someone else mentioned previously (on soompi i think, forgot who) BoongDo’s way of dealing with things is very Taoist– take things as they go, adjust to what’s around (which by the way is a funny mixture: he becomes an official by acing tests on Confucian classics, takes life with Taoist attitude, and visits/respects Buddhist monks<– though it may be due to the amulet more than anything)– so he didn't mind much having to adjust to modern world and not look at HJ with judgemental eyes (paring her with Confucian standards), or cutting his top-knot out of necessity… but he was ALWAYS courteous, respectful, and considerate– i.e. even when he tries out things that are outrageous to Confucian standards, he makes sure with HJ that it's acceptable to her (world)
so in that sense, along with how busy BoongDo actually was the night of the "bed scene"– jumping back in time to go to the mountains and speak with the monk before coming back for HJ to see him at the window– i highly doubt IT happened; he didn't 100% decide yet that he was going to stay in the future (which happened later at the phone booth), proven by the burning-amulet scare later, so how could he do something like that to HJ? it's just unfathomable considering how cautious he is <– yeah, this too, he may take risks doing crazy things, but he'd never do one without thinking and if he thinks it might harm another person.
ep 12, for all it's worth was a decent episode with some really really good questions you don't see in other time-travel stories(at least not ones i know of), about how this new knowledge/discovery of the new world affects how he sees his own time. but then again i may be too spoiled with the first 10 episodes of 80% brains and 10% cute to establish a really romantic story to stomach this 20% brain and 80% cute… so in that sense, I agree with you Ms. Koala: Ms. Writer-nim, PLEASE don't disappoint us with an otherwise PERFECT drama and BRING BACK THE BRAINY~~~ <3 I don't want QIHM to be JUST another romcom!!
ackkk 20% cute (LOL how can i screw up on this math here…)
You guys may want to watch brainy instead of cute, but imagine if it is your own life story, would you rather have a brainy man or a man naughty man. Am sure you know that brain alone won’t get you the girl. We already know how intelligent he is, but no girl wants to be bored with that all the time. Therefore, the writier knows what she/he is doing showing us he’s manly and take charge with my woman side..
hahaha in all honesty, in really life I’d want a brainy man– who like Kim Boong Do has just a touch of harmless humor/tease ^__< and i welcome him to take charge as a man if he does it like Kim Boong Do does– *gently, respectfully, and with consideration for what's best for everyone* =P
i know… it's too perfect to ask for in real life XD
Wow, thanks for the discussion and sharing of thoughts! I’m one who is firmly in the ‘out of character’ camp (probably writer bowing to fan service, methinks), but I see how it could just be him letting loose/ being selfish for once in his life as well.
But! Just 4 episodes left! Let’s all start praying/ hoping the writer manages to end this drama satisfyingly, appropriately, and consistently!
Want to share my thoughts too!
First, I do agree the ”You won’t stay with me” was off character. This is the only thing that put me off. The kiss, well, I’m not sure. I mean, seeing what the situation was: BD risked his life to meet HJ again, after going to the future he finds out nobody remembers him and that HJ might not believe he was real too. We could see his sadness when he was talking with SK, and how he hesitated when he finally found her at the phothe booth before confiming they sahre the same feelings.
After this, they decided to meet later in HJ’s house. There he saw DM hugging and trying to kiss HJ. And the the words of DM about he being HJ’s boyfriend were something that BD knew were true.
Then they went to that place, and HJ had to go back to DM and SK to fix the things. They didn’t even had time to talk yet, and she was already leaving him again – this I can understand why he wanted her to stay, but the ”You will leave me all alone here” implying her to stay the night with him put me off.
I don’t know, the writer could use another line or something like this, because it didn’t fit BD’s character. I would prefer if BD said ”You are leaving without giving a proper goodbye(Hj’s style)?” and then he would give her that hot kiss and she would stay lol~
But still, I hope they didn’t sleep together because this is very out off character for BD, but aside it I have no problems about episode 12, I didn’t see anything strange about BD in that episode. He was more caring? Well, maybe because they had confirmed their feelings and no longer needed to play with words and everything was clear between them. As for BD showing his feelings in public, I don’t see nothing wrong about it, I mean, he knows in her world this is something normal – there isn’t no etiquete or morals against it in her world. He doesn’t need to repress his feelings in HJ’s era, and this must be great for him, he even told back at the library scene how her world was good because people could show their feelings like that in public and betwen a woman and man. Plus BD studied HJ’s world for some days already, I’m sure he saw some couples too and how they react. And he learns fast…
And if BD was really that scholar so righteous and all, I don’t think he would ever kiss HJ in the library – because I believe he already knew it wasn’t a goodbye gesture… and even though he knew he still kissed her and even teased her.
In the joseon times he is also playful with his servant and also teased him, so I think BD was always playful…. it is just he couldn’t show this much before because he was focused on cleaning his family’s name and giving back the queen title o queen in Hyun. After he finally realized his plans/wishes (and knowing how story will be on his favor) he let him loose a bit after 5 years…
Ops I meant ”out of character” not off… lol
I think you guys are taking the ‘you won’t stay with me” the wrong way. He didn’t mean, stay and sleep with me. He mean’t more like, are you really going to leave me alone in this house by myself, someone who doesn’t belong to this world and does not yet understand all the modern in’s and out’s….are you going to live me alone. That is what he mean’t.
Never leave a comment here before but I’ll try leaving one because I want to speak my mind too.
I don’t think the whole “Spent the night with me” is that racy. I mean, you can’t say that to your friends? I certainly did say that to all my friends and seriously, nothing ever happened. We can see afterwards that Boong Do watch over Hee Jin from afar, and he rarely slept on the bed. So I don’t think they did what you think they did.
About personality shift, I don’t think it even shifted a little bit. He might be raised and lived in Joseon era where everything strict and you need to follow the rules, but even the King have concubines, so why people think the men should be different? Gisaeng is there not for a decoration, but for people to unleash all their hidden desire. So it’s just normal for him to want to be with Hee Jin for the night after what happened before, when he almost forget all about her and that he felt like he couldn’t back to the future where Hee Jin is.
People might disagree, but I still think that this drama is the best in their characterization. I hate K-drama for the reason that they always disappoint me when their leading heroes are so charming in the first episode then turn to be stupid and weepy toward the ending. So this Boong Do, who’s always smart and intelligent and playful and logical and calm, win my heart instantly.
But back to the initial question, people are different and so do opinions. It’s more fun to have different insight and ideas than just agreeing to something without questioning it, right?
Lastly, thanks for the written preview. I’m excited for episode 13 because I think we’ll see more action.
Well, but the thing is HJ is the woman he loves, not someone to satisfy his sexual desires. She isn’t a gisaeng. She is the woman he loves…….
In that era the men respected the woman they loved… by respetc I mean, they only touched them after marriage.
@cindy – re: “Well, but the thing is HJ is the woman he loves, not someone to satisfy his sexual desires.”
If you’ve ever been in love…sexual desire & satisfaction are actually quite MUTUAL.
@harunomasu pointed out, I think rather smartly, that the upper class (power families) had exactly what they always do —every means of relieving frustrations — without incurring injury to the family name.
Concubines….Gisaengs….household slaves. Not only legal, but permissible at the highest levels.
I’m reading for QIHM on several forums and there is an overiding expectation that Boong-Do is a paragon of celebate virtue. Yet, his character is a man in love beyond the boundaries of time. She is his Muse…..and she’s a modern woman who initiates skinship.
I think he LIKES it.
cheers ~:)
What I mean to say is, if in the past people can have gisaengs as their way to relief their desire, why a man like Boong Do can’t do it too? And it’s with someone he loves? He did it in the 2012 era anyway, where everything not as strict as the past. Like I pointed it too, not that they really did it. It’s unclear whether they did it or not (and I believe they didn’t) because of the setting (Hee Jin is still wearing her clothes, I can see the white strap on her shoulder).
But like I said again, people differs so do opinion 🙂
@harunomasu —- I’m honestly not fixated on whether or not the night they spent together included deep-intimacy.
I surely can’t be the only girl on this forum who has ever slept arm-in-arm with a guy whom:
*I did not have sex with
*there was no promise of potential marriage, but rather we LIKED the warmth of sleeping side-by-sde
It’s totally possible. Why shouldn’t Scholar Kim be able to cuddle too? 😉
You guys are such pruds. Did you leave in that era? How would you know what really went on…what…because of what’s written in history books. Please, use your imagination. Now and then, man is man and willl always be. I want respect from a man, but not the kind of respect you guys are referring to here and I don’t think loving someone mean’t you have to wait till marriage, even in the olden days. Why do you think they sometimes marry sooner if not to preven shut gun weddings.
They were supposed to meet for a date after a month, but then shit hit the fan and everything was out the window. When he suddenly teleported and remembered Heejin (we all know they like each other by now) and learning that Heejin got herself a boyfriend in his absence…oh IDK wouldn’t that give a person a jolt or something? And when everything’s sorted out and they kissed like nobody’s business, which I think sealed the deal – they became in fact, actual lovers that night which I think is sufficient enough to justify Boongdo’s change, he was so reserved and proper because their relationship was still uncertain before ep 11 and 12. You won’t act all loveydovey with a person if you’re still not sure about their feelings and the status of relationship..and I’m pretty sure that the tiptoe kiss gave him the go signal to go all out now. So the change really is no surprise at all. About the modern ways, Boongdo’s character is established as someone who is smart and adaptable, some modern ways may not be acceptable during his time but since these modernities are acceptable and blend him in with the new world, why act like an ancient man?
Okay, people be confusing things up here, so let me use an analogy.
Boong Do = Joseon yangban as to Fitzwilliam Darcy = starchy Victorian gentlemen.
Boong Do was written so consistently in the first 10 eps his abrupt loosening of his ingrained social cues is the entire point I am making. One does not live a yangban life for nearly 3 decades and toss it out the window that quickly even taking into account his early time traveling stints. Kissing and hugging was a big deal for him. But asking her to spend the night? The Boong Do we’ve come to know wouldn’t do that with a gisaeng back in Joseon era, much less a woman he respects and wants to do right by.
Think back to the tight and rigid social codes Austen wrote about in her novels. Lydia’s elopement with Wickham would have brought down the entire Bennet family but for Darcy buying their respectability. Equate Joseon high society social codes with Victorian moral and you ought to get the picture. Would Darcy have asked Lizzie to spend the night? Would time-traveling Darcy ever ask any woman he fell in love with in 2012 to spend the night? Before they were married? Hell, Darcy almost burst a vein before he would confess to Lizzie that he “esteemed her”. Haha, that was some impassioned speech, eh. That’s about the extent of passion a yangban would be showing to his love interest. Boong Do is already busted out of that with Hee Jin, but to ask her to spend the night pretty much throws him to the left side of the moon.
So, the only thing bothering you the most is the spend the night, right?
But do you believe them did it? I think the writer want us to believe they did, but they didn’t. There wasn’t enough time! lol
I hope next episode SK asks what HJ did last night and ask if she spend the night with BD and we have a flashback of BD saying it’s not right for them sleep/to be in the same bed. And leave HJ all frustrated hahahaha. Heeee. I hope.
Love this discussion 🙂 But that’s the point, Boong-do is not a Darcy, he’s not uptight like him. He’s a confucianist and that makes him open minded. I got this from Wikipedia “The core of Confucianism is humanism, the belief that human beings are teachable, improvable and perfectible through personal and communal endeavour especially including self-cultivation and self-creation.”
oops I want to reply to ockoala..
Uhm, it would be best if you didn’t pull Confucius summaries from Wikipedia. It’s much more than that, and I haven’t the time to delve into a philosophy discussion at this point. Joseon yangbans were Confucian scholar-officials, considered custodians of proper Confucian mores. They were not open-minded to what was proper or improper behavior. It was one way or the highway.
I don’t think BD is a Josun Darcy though. He’s nowhere near as uptight. He’s a lot more open-minded and adapting. What Darcy’d do or wouldn’t do has no relation to what BD’d do or wouldn’t do. BD is also in a different situation. Who has a mind to stay proper when there’s a 300 yrs rift breathing down your neck, threatening to take away everything in one blink of the eye? Priority, I’d say. And really, who’s to say “staying the night” isn’t just simply “staying the night?” Perhaps that was all he was asking for. They’ve just gone through an existential seperation and any more separation so soon would really unnerve him. Maybe he just wanted her within reach. I get it that it was bold and fan-servicy but I don’t think it warrants an outcry. Heck, Mr Thornton kissed Margaret at the train station in public and I love it because sometimes a little inaccuracy for viewing purposes is still awesome.
p.s. PK has also done some grabbity kiss v.v. unYangbanlike and stayed w her in her room through the night which stayed chaste and honorable.
Oh, I love how you bring up the infamous kiss at the train station, *sigh in happiness* for Mr Thornton and Margaret.
I need a public kiss for our QIHM couple too ^^
I am surprised about the mention of Fitzwilliam Darcy.
But I think, that if you throw Darcy into modern world, give him a while, you might see him change, I highly doubt Darcy will remain as the dazzling man of Austen’s world. Why? Because our ‘id’ and ‘super ego’ are the bounding factors of one’s personality due to the constraints of the external world around us, society. Buffered by our ‘ego’. So if one’s society changes, the ‘ego’ might then buffer it according to the society currently experienced by the person. Hence we see the changes in BD. He MAY have been a male who is highly romantic back in the Joseon days, but due to the contraints of society, he may be unable to show those affection, controlled by his ‘ego’ to ensure he fits into society. And once he lands in the modern world, his ‘ego’ is excited as it can finally not have the ‘super ego’ fighting so hard for perfection and let the ‘id’ take some control for some satisfaction. Which is why I think that yes, the change is a bit ‘woah’ at times, I like how dorky and awkward he is when he first arrived, but also, there are possible explanations as to how he adapted and ‘changed’.
KBD is a smart man, and he is highly adaptable. Still human of course, 3 days to learn how to use a pay phone, but he observes, listens and then acts. He would have, over the course of the time spent in modern time, understood the ways to show affection by observing other couples, or, he could just be finally ripping off the contraints of the Joseon era and ‘open up’ to the new experience and embrace it well. A bit fast? Possibly. But like others, pretty sure nothing happened between them. She slept, whilst he time travelled. My only concern, how does he survive with so little sleep?
Totally agree with Koala~chan about the weird jarring of Boong Do’s romantic personality shift in ep11. Not that i didnt like the whole ‘passionate’ display afterwards and their cute date in ep12. Heck…i’ve replayed the last 10minutes of ep11 like for a gazillion times and i’ve been wanting to hear the patter of little feet for our OTP. But like Koala~chan said…i thought it felt out of character. And yes….maybe after a few months in modern day and Boong Do pulled the puppy-eyes-stay-with-me-pout-pout-pout-thing with Hee Jin, i would have bought it. But right after recovering his memory….really…not convinced. What my pervy brain wants, and what i warrant should make sense in dramaland are 2 different things. (ok…granted alot of kdramas doesnt make sense but QIHM have been doing great so far.) Love the lip-lock eye candy though. XD
“Spend the night” is being taken out of contest here. I really believe he only mean’t whether she’s leaving him alone in that Apt, in a world he has yet to know all the in’s and out’s by himself.
I think he was more forward with his affections as he doesn’t know how much time he has left with Heejin. He has read his history and knows that he is about to be framed as a traitor and killed so he is trying to spend as much time as he can with her. Even though he was enjoying his time with her I still saw him as apprehensive and worried about the future and wants to treasure what he has with her.
even though this could be a filler i totally dig the cute and lovey dovey scenes. i looove their chemistry together.
Interesting discussion and I’m loving every comment!
I maybe the odd one out there but I actually found Ep 11 a bit flat on plot yet Ep 12 picked it up again. To me the big issue in Ep 12 is how BD actually considered to make 2012 his real home from now on. And that would explain how he’s trying to catch up all things modern.
Was it an abrupt request by BD for HJ to spend the night with him? Yes. Was this request really out of the context? That I would give a No, with regard to how he risked his life to find out his lost memory and how he finds himself in an alternate world having only HJ remembering him. From day 1 since BD time-travelled he’s been learning how the old social rules in Joseon era no longer plays significant part in the modern world, but the more important thing is, the woman he loves has been teaching him how to express one’s affection, modern-style. I think it’s his way to reciprocate his feeling to HJ (with the same level of passion as HJ) in Ep 11.
Just my 2 cents.
Very interesting discussion here. I personally felt that something felt off on ep 11. But the kiss killed all of my brain cells and it was all I could do not to hit the replay button over and over again. And then came ep 12 and all the lovey-dovey scenes, I found myself swooning and eating up all the cheese again…and then some.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that its hard to make an objective commentary when I can barely form a coherent thought watching BD kiss HJ like there’s no tomorrow, and HJ responding with equal passion. Maybe it was fan service or the actors themselves *ahem* getting carried away and nudging the script towards a certain direction, I don’t know. I guess we shall see in the next few eps.
hi koala! first time commenting here even though ive been reading for a while but someone at dramabeans said a discussion was going on here so i wanted to see what it was about and i have to admit, i think i agree.
there was something off about episode 12 despite its cute, i couldnt put my finger on it, like i knew boongdo had lost his unicorn feel for me, what made him so special. when i watch ep 3,4,5 i just adore him and his joseon mannerisms and so i attributed the shift to the fact that he wasnt wearing his beanie anymore lol!
but yeah, i wish he would keep his yangbaness all the way through because i really liked him that way 🙁 now hes just a normal loving modern bf and though it doesnt concern me that much with the whole bed thing but still… cant put my finger on the exact reasoning why i feel this way but your explanation is good 🙂
LOL. Episode 12 gave us some interesting and major questions – Boongdo’s future in the “future”, will he stay? leaving the old world behind or will he return…and the thing about the talisman/fate getting its payback.
Just because it was filled/adorned with couple moments doesn’t mean the plot didn’t move forward.
I’ll bow and say it’s fanservice. Hooray! 🙂
I think everyone is entitled to his or her opinion and the fact that everyone cares so much just goes to show how invested people are in these characters…but please, reading too much into everything might ruin the experience of enjoying what it is. 不要小題大做!
Hmm…it seems in character to me because he did lay that kiss on her in the library out of the camera sights weeks ago LOL
He’s moving forward…he did say his one ability is to learn and adapt LOL. He also is planning to move to the future and take responsibility for her as his.
I didn’t take it as a bed scene myself but it was left open to interpretation.
Newbie here. I love the discussion but I don’t agree about the out of character of BD. First men are men no matter what time they are. Doesn’t matter how they were raised they always want to go foward. Specially if they are in love. To me they did it because she wasn’t with her clothes in the bed nor when she gets up covering her self with the sheets. If you are dress up why cover?
He have the vibe of Jeseon man because he is one but at the same time the writer is always telling you he adapt to the situation, he is playful, HJ think he is a player. There is not sudden change. He definetelly did make a sudden change if they didn’t kiss several time before, weren’t teasing themselves with those looks and he stopped her at least once then I can say it was weird. Maybe the only weird thing was the way he said it. If he said it in a more poetic way can change the straight foward way he said it but again HJ said she is dumb and he needs to say it clearly. ^_^
By the way Koala thank you very much for your recaps in K2H I enyoyed them a lot.
Hello everyone,
First time commenting here, awed at the intense discussion going on 🙂
As I’m new to Korean culture/history/dramas, I would love to hear more about Yangban(s) – have not had the chance to watch Tamra yet 🙁
Is it the norm for a Yangban to be skilled at martial arts and be part of an uprising? To me when the word Joseon scholar was mentioned i immediately just thought oh, a nerd…in the real sense, not rebellious and all.
But since the first episode my impression was like oooh… Kim Boong Do – Scholar by day, Spy at night, hence not really fitting with the nerdy uptight figure.
Or… is Boong Do’s secret activities acceptable and not so out of character for him as, given what Jomo said, he went through the traumatic event of losing his family?
i don’t care..a man still a man…especially when fall in love….
they change….
and him too…
he miss her sooooooo much so it’s ok to be a bit mushy..
i love kim boong do!!!!!!!!!!!!!! and hee jin